Shyvoodoo

[Shyv]

*So the build I decided on ended up being 12 Cleric/6 Paladin/2 Monk. I'm very happy with how the build played through all levels not only in how it worked, but how much fun it was to level. So now that I'm capped it's time to start the raid train on him to start the gearing for epic quests. I still haven't run any raids other than Chrono and Reaver on this guy, and not even flagged all the way for Shroud, let alone Amrath. So if you need one more beater, look me up!


http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z120/Shyv_DDO/ScreenShot00230.jpg





Ok, wanted to bounce some ideas around for my latest character. I can't decide between 15 cleric/5 paladin, 13 cleric/5 paladin/2 monk, or 12 cleric/6 paladin/2 monk for this Horc Battle Cleric, emphasis on battle.

I originaly was going to go the battle caster path with melee thrown in, but decided on putting more emphasis on melee combat. So wanted to get down in print what each gives up and gains. Other ideas welcome.

Current build is a level 9 cleric. I am waiting till level 13 to multi-class because I felt it was important to get Radiant Servant 2 and Heal before anything else.

15 cleric/5 paladin

8th level spells: Mass Cure Critical, Death Pact, Holy Aura
1 extra 5th, 6th, and 7th level spell over 13 cleric
+2d6 BB over 13 cleric, +3d6 BB over 12 cleric

No Evasion
Missing 2 melee feats
No Hunter of the Dead PrE

13 cleric/5 paladin/2 monk

7th level spells: Mass Cure Serious, Mass Prot from Elements, Resurrection
Evasion
2 melee feats
+1d6 BB over 12 cleric

Missing 8th level spells
-2d6 BB from 15 cleric
No Hunter of the Dead PrE

12 cleric/6 paladin/2 monk

Hunter of the Dead PrE

Missing 7th and 8th level spells
-3d6 BB from 15 cleric and -1d6 BB from 13 cleric

[Shyv]

So I guess the questions are:

1.) How important is the extra BB damage and the 7th and 8th level spells?
2.) Are the extra turns, ghost touched, and healing amp abilities of Hunter of the Dead worth giving up 7th level spells?

Build note: 2 handed using a falchion is the plan for melee.

Feats: Empower Healing, Quicken, Maximize, Extend, Toughness, Power Attack, Improved Critical: Slashing

If 2 Monk: Take Toughness and Power Attack with the monk feats then pick up Two-handed Fighting, and Improved Two-handed Fighting with base feats. I would consider dropping Extend for Greater Two-handed Fighting, but it would mean re-casting the short term buffs a lot more frequently. Could also consider dropping toughness later on with all the self-healing, but right now during leveling, the extra HP are too good to give up.

[Aexicas]

Hm, question Shyv...

Why 5 paladin over 4 paladin? BAB isn't going to be much of a problem, from the Divine power aspect, and the only appreciable thing I see you getting would be divine might (which, while good, might be better served with another level of cleric, or otherwise)

As for Hunter of the Dead PrE being worth it...

The real question is, can you wait for it, for the end concept?

At 20? I think it'd be nice. Turns out the yin-yang, with a bunch of other nice concepts, but it's the whole getting there thing that could be the problem. Not saying you, yourself, will have a problem with that, mind, just an observation.

I don't think you'd lost -that- much by giving up the 7ths and 8ths, from the way the concept is mapped, and if this is intended to be a soloer more than others, I don't think it'll give you much issue. The caster level is where itll hurt, but thats supplantable by focusing on playstyle.

All in all, a good concept, I'd like to see how it plays.

[Impaqt]

What is so interesting about L5 Paladin?

15 Cleric/3 Paladin/2Monk

or even flip the Pal and Monk so you can pick up a Path for some extra damage as well.

[Aexicas]

Path won't much matter if he keeps with falchion. Though, quarterstaves might be an interesting alternative, presuming that Horc bonuses work on Qstaff too.

[Shyv]

What is so interesting about L5 Paladin?

15 Cleric/3 Paladin/2Monk

or even flip the Pal and Monk so you can pick up a Path for some extra damage as well.



I'm in class so I'll just answer this one quickly: :)

Why 5 Paladin? Divine Sacrifice.

I like the synergy a lot and it turns that falchion into a 15-20/x3 with the added light dmg everytime I activate it. Good input so far, keep it up.

Back to class stuff now. Why they give us computers with internet and think we're going to pay attention is beyond me. :D

[moorewr]

I enjoyed DS and exalted smite quite a bit on my rogadin. He has other problems, but he sure could wail on people.

[Shyv]

Hm, question Shyv...

Why 5 paladin over 4 paladin? BAB isn't going to be much of a problem, from the Divine power aspect, and the only appreciable thing I see you getting would be divine might (which, while good, might be better served with another level of cleric, or otherwise)

As for Hunter of the Dead PrE being worth it...

The real question is, can you wait for it, for the end concept?

At 20? I think it'd be nice. Turns out the yin-yang, with a bunch of other nice concepts, but it's the whole getting there thing that could be the problem. Not saying you, yourself, will have a problem with that, mind, just an observation.

I don't think you'd lost -that- much by giving up the 7ths and 8ths, from the way the concept is mapped, and if this is intended to be a soloer more than others, I don't think it'll give you much issue. The caster level is where itll hurt, but thats supplantable by focusing on playstyle.

All in all, a good concept, I'd like to see how it plays.

Ok, now that I'm home.

5 Paladin over 4 for the uses of Divine Sacrifice. I like the synergy of the extra dmg on a class that won't have any issue with the loss of HP on use. Clerics get the Divine Might enhancement too so I would be taking that with the cleric levels, only the first 2 tiers though.

Yeah it does kinda suck to not get Hunter of the Dead and Divine Sacrifice till the tail end of the leveling process. But such are the breaks I guess. Heal and Blade Barrier are just too good to put off till later on, so it's a battle of when to get which.

I like Hunter of the Dead because of the 2 extra turns that should (I think)be able to be used towards the Healing Aura of Radiant Servant 2. I'm not 100% sure on that though so further testing may be needed. I also like the Healing Amp bonus of the PrE. The ghost touched is just a nice addition. If the turns don't stack I would just take KotC for some extra dmg against demons and devils.

Not to worried about caster level on spells since the only spell I'd be using against mobs is blade barrier. I certainly won't be landing any of the instant kill or command spells so I'm not too concerned about that aspect of it.

For the most part I either solo or shortman everything so that's the thinking behind the design. I certainly wouldn't apply for a healer spot in any group. But hell even if I was a 20 cleric I wouldn't apply. Just not my style. ;)

[Shyv]

Hit level 16 last night and loving every minute of playing him.

Self-buffed (and 3 ship buffs) with Positive Energy Aura Running
http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z120/Shyv_DDO/ScreenShot00084.jpg

Pic is a bit blurry.

+50 dmg, +35 to hit, 361 Hp, 725 SP, 37 fort, 25 reflex, 33 will

Still need: +2 str tome, +1(or 2) dex tome, +2 con tome, +2 wis tome, and of course ToD rings.

[Shyv]

Still undecided on the final build out, even at this late stage.

I like the idea of divine sacrifice with 5 levels of paladin, but have moved away from the 6 levels for the paladin PrE. I was going to take hunter of the dead, but with either the spectral gloves or Mabar cloak the ghost touched ability is a wash and the 2 extra turns wouldn't really matter since I rarely run out now with the regeneration of turns. So I'm more in favor of another level of cleric to get access to level 7 spells. They're not great, but another mass cure is always helpful.

I thought Divine Sacrifice would be good with Falchions since it improved the crit multiplier, but what I didn't know at the time was that the horc two-handed animation is only on greataxes and mauls and I don't like the look of the attack chain with the other two-handers now. (Yes I know it's silly) But is the extra 4d6 light dmg, occasional x4 crit, and 2 extra smite evils worth taking. What is the cooldown on divine sacrifice anyway? (Been a long time since I've played a paladin.)

Or should I just take paladin 3 and push the cleric levels up to 15? Level 8 spells are pretty nice for battle clerics with the yummy death pact becoming available and Holy Aura. Question on holy aura though, it's listed as a resistance bonus to saves. Does this stack with everything else?

So final build out is either:

13 Cleric/5 Paladin/2 Monk
or
15 Cleric/3 Paladin/2 Monk

What do you all think?

[Eldamir]

I vote 15/3/2

1) maximize your blade barrier damage
2) lvl7 spells
3) longer divine power and divine favor (i think)


6 second cooldown on exalted smite
5 second cooldown on divine sacrifice
No cooldown on divine righteousness (i know you didn't ask, but since i was resetting enhancements ... :))

[Shyv]

updated OP with final build and screenshot. Very happy with this build

[Jules]

Would you post your starting stats and leveling information for this character?

Jules

[Shyv]

Used a +5 LR and a +3 LR on this guy. Build is now an 18 cleric/2 fighter.

[moorewr]

Used a +5 LR and a +3 LR on this guy. Build is now an 18 cleric/2 fighter.

What prompted the change?

[Shyv]

What prompted the change?

The original build is by far the most fun build I've ever leveled up, and a fair share of fun at cap. However, with the way epics are designed, there isn't a good place for a "cleric" with less than 17 levels or a melee that gives up DPS for utility.

Since I have one character on the completionist path, I wanted 2 reliable characters that I can play in end-game and epics. So now I've got a 20 wizard and an 18 cleric/2 fighter. It's still a melee battlecleric, but now I can step back and really heal like a true cleric if the situation calls for it.

[moorewr]

The original build is by far the most fun build I've ever leveled up, and a fair share of fun at cap. However, with the way epics are designed, there isn't a good place for a "cleric" with less than 17 levels or a melee that gives up DPS for utility.

Since I have one character on the completionist path, I wanted 2 reliable characters that I can play in end-game and epics. So now I've got a 20 wizard and an 18 cleric/2 fighter. It's still a melee battlecleric, but now I can step back and really heal like a true cleric if the situation calls for it.

Word. The "epic funnel" at work.